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Post by SNL_Ali on Apr 13, 2005 12:14:16 GMT -5
Alright, I know there are a lot of atheists on this forum, so bear with me. ^^;; Everyone else, feel free to put up your own religion's relations to daemons. As some of you may or may not know, I'm a Baha'i. Fun little link here.I was browsing around one of my Youth forums, and stumbled across this thread titled "Dog Souls". I was intrigued, and found that it was basically talking about whether or not one will see pets or animals in the next life. I scrolled down, and found this fun description of a soul, i wonder what we WILL be doing in the next world. i don't think we can even begin to speculate. 'Abdu'l-Baha talked a bit about the spirit. one of the things He said that i find very interesting is the nature and relationship to the body that the soul possesses. according to The Master, the soul does not reside in the body, but rather animates it, in much the same way a puppets strings are pulled by invisible hands (that last analogy was mine, not The Masters...don't wanna be blasphemous). He said that in dream the soul soars freely, and that when we die, our sould is rid of our body and is free like a bird whose cage has been broken.
so it seems then that our bodies are not nearly comparable to our souls. what i mean is this: you see a sunrise and you say "i see a sunrise" and you taste an apple and say "i taste this apple." however, our soul is capable of infinitely more and deeper modes of perception. our bodies do not allow our souls to reach their full potential until they have grown enough to exist without the body, dig? it's like a pipe. at first the stream of water from the pipe is gradual. our souls begin at infancy and are weak and haven't grown. as our sould grow, the water begins to come out more quickly and in more volume, so to speak. we continue to grow until our souls are very strong. the water COULD be going a LOT faster and in a LOT more volume, but their potentials are actually inhibited by our earthly forms. our mortal reasoning. our senses. our biology.
losing this body and moving on seems like a very very joyous occurance to me. it would be like seeing through a tiny hole in a blank all your life. and then finally the blanket is thrown off. when we die we will no longer be restricted by our limited senses and our limited mental capacity. we will soar in self-awareness and revelation. we will sing.Thats a quote from one of the members, and to me it just really sang out loud about what a daemon is, My religion has never really had any conflicts with believing in daemons, this just kinda confirmed it. Anyone else found any connections with their religious beliefs? And atheists--be kind now, y'hear?
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Post by cock of teh walk on Apr 13, 2005 13:10:06 GMT -5
wow *awe* that was amazing *epiphany*
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Sil and Veil
dæmian
"I'm not frigging Bambi you know."-Veil
Posts: 325
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Post by Sil and Veil on Apr 13, 2005 16:10:29 GMT -5
Wicca/Paganism has the concept of spirit guides, animals who are your sort of totem, and assist you through times of troubles.
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Post by |3200k1 on Apr 13, 2005 17:38:55 GMT -5
Wicca/Paganism has the concept of spirit guides, animals who are your sort of totem, and assist you through times of troubles. *nod* I'm a pagan witch,so I agree with her. Daemons have been used in plenty of diffrent culture for forever as angels (some angelic beings were animals), totems in the native america nculture,and druidism had spirit guides and such. We're really open about it. *goes to link* I'm a religion freak. :-D Edit: I like that. It is interesting,though I just skimmed the basics. XD It has alot of good principles that I agree with. *will look up more later* I plan on minoring in world religions...
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Alexei & Kryii
dæmian
[Corleone]Whiskas? I don't need no stinkin' Whiskas.[/Corleone]
Posts: 322
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Post by Alexei & Kryii on Apr 13, 2005 18:17:00 GMT -5
I am the essence of "the seeker" concept--I have gone from raised in Christianity to looking at Wicca to Buddhism to... I'm somewhere in this morass of all three, with a touch of "pagan" as well, since pagan is "grander" in one sense than Wicca. Shamanism is something that draws me then pushes me away, as did all of the rest. Nowhere have I found precepts that, on a completly integrated basis, I can accept. And these include somewhat "major" principles. Yeah.
"When the student is ready, the teacher will come." -_- Helpful. Really. Bloody. Helpful.
Sometimes, I see Totems and Familiars and the rest and shout "dæmon!" Then I think of things like the fact that Totems were usually much more limited than dæmons are--though still appropriate and all, there are times when they are different, too. I actually think I have an owl or hawk totem, but my "Chroi" is a putty-tat. Familars, as well, are an imperfect name, for familars are not, actually, dæmons, but paredrii, and were kept seperate from dæmons, that have been called spirit guides, and even Eudæmons, the "Guardian Angel." Totems, however, still fit and fall into place, for the totem never changes, and is almost always singualr in nature--you never have two totems. Familiars, however, may be called upon often, and more than one is often used: indeed, aone may have a dog, two cats, some fish, a bird, and then an "ethereal" panther, leopard, and dolphin. All my be familiars, spirits who guide and help with magic and the shaping of intention. A totem is more of a defining characteristic of a person.
One thinks of Ayla's Cave Lion or Broud's Wolly Rhinoceros in Clan of the Cave Bear: more, the very Cave Bear itself is the Totem for the entire Clan-- for all Neanderthals. Wee.
On the Christian side, yes and no. Many Saints are said to have been in commune with animals--the fact that Saint Patrick became a stag while resiting the prayer now called "St. Patrick's Breastplate" is no mistake--not only a strong shamanic symbol and an enemy of the serpent (in at least some traditions), it was also a stag, in some of the legends, who helped free the young slave Patrick while he was supposed to be watching 'his' flock.
Then again, totemic and familial (in the sense of familiars) practices in the New World, Australia and Oceana, Southern Aisa, Africa, and South America were all ridiculed and seemingly crushed by the spreading Christian faith--not to mention the same thing in Europe both before, during, and after the "Age of Discovery." Think of the 2 million deaths associated with the Witch Trials, as well as the many hung (and one smothered, God Bless Giles Cory, a real hero) in Salem, a European colony in America.
As far as Buddhist thought... that is so varied from schools on one side (the "Little Vessel" practices) to the other ("Big Vessel") that there is both support of such an idea and spite of it.
In other words... I don't rightly know, since I am not any religion right now. Bah.
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Post by |3200k1 on Apr 13, 2005 18:28:34 GMT -5
I am the essence of "the seeker" concept--I have gone from raised in Christianity to looking at Wicca to Buddhism to... I'm somewhere in this morass of all three, with a touch of "pagan" as well, since pagan is "grander" in one sense than Wicca. . I completely understand. I've developed my own beliefs to the point that they are primarily Pagan in nature,and therefore call myself as such. XP Wasn't St.Patricks being a stag a way to help the transition the pagans had to make to christianity easier because of the familiarity in the form? >_>; I jsut read the DaVinci Code and a few other similar (non-fiction )books.
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Alexei & Kryii
dæmian
[Corleone]Whiskas? I don't need no stinkin' Whiskas.[/Corleone]
Posts: 322
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Post by Alexei & Kryii on Apr 13, 2005 19:09:13 GMT -5
And Yule is why Christmas is about 6 months off, too. Then again... St. Patrick was simply the most readily avalible idea, seeing as how me mum is from a strong Irish background.
St. Francis of Assisi obviously is one who connected to animals, but there was one that always acompanied him... I simply can't 'member it. **Note: I am not and was not raised Catholic. Thus, my knowledge tends to be more limited than it might have been had I sought confirmation.** Both of the above may well have been patron saints, as well as Saint Andrew and Saint George (who was said to have a bird--occasionaly a dove, but not always--as a companion).
Hrm... who else... Sts. Teresa and Cathrine (the later of whom was one of the voices with whom St. Joan of Arc was said to have communed) both had animal "totems," I think. Though St. Margaret my be in palce of one of them.
Yeah. In some really, really old Greek texts, not New Testement but contemporary Christian Works that survived the destruction of such works, hint at companions of Jesus, Mary Magdalene, and even Judas Iscariot.
Though a lot of this is hardly official dogma in any way. Remember that before you quote what I say as hard fact... I'm probably wrong in many places, and if Catholosism is correct, I've been damned to Hell for long enough I am not going to go scrabling all over to make sure I'm not wrong.
Pie. ^^
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Post by Kaye&Lanh on Apr 14, 2005 5:54:49 GMT -5
I was raised in the Chruch, and since becoming older, I've gotten more interested in certain parts of the Bible. Mostly about Adam and Eve. I'vegot theories, but I don't want to bore you to death.
Anyway, apparently if you're really religious in the Catholic church, Dæmons are a big no-no. As are astrology, the tarot, and other divination things. So I'll see you all in Hell.
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Post by Tatl & Valian on Apr 14, 2005 6:08:13 GMT -5
Waa? I'm not Catholic, but how are dæmons against it? Thei're not really magic or anything...
Anyway, I got nada. ^_^
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Post by Zoe 'n' Calosta on Apr 14, 2005 11:50:09 GMT -5
Well my mother is uber-religious and when I told her about Cal, she mentioned that she had been reading a book about guardian angels and apparently, some are in the form of animals like eagles and oxes and....PANTHERS!!!! Those were just examples of course but I've always thought of Cal as my guardian angel, chosen especially for me ^^
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Post by cock of teh walk on Apr 14, 2005 13:06:01 GMT -5
He said that in dream the soul soars freely, and that when we die, our sould is rid of our body and is free like a bird whose cage has been broken
so, what, being human is like being...punished? Why would a soul lower itself like that, go down a step to be less capable of amazing things. Is it a kindof, be trapped so later you will appreciate the freedom even more? Also...Im a bit confused , um if your soul dissapears , soul being daemon right now, where do YOU go? Or are we both the soul, just sortof divided into male/female , concious/subconcious and we like, bond together in death? Maybe that is the freedom he means, the freedom to be...sexless and expirience all your levels of thought at once and understand them. Is it just me or does the way he talk about make it seem like the body sortof...hampers the soul, or holds it back from its real potential.....ill tell you what though im not afraid of death anymore.
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Post by Lulu on Apr 14, 2005 13:13:03 GMT -5
Anyway, apparently if you're really religious in the Catholic church, Dæmons are a big no-no. As are astrology, the tarot, and other divination things. So I'll see you all in Hell. I don't get that though. I mean, I get Philip Pullman's books not being liked by the church, because of the attack on the Authority and that link to God and blah. But surely daemons are just like your soul. Or even your conscience. But I mean. The concept is the same. Believing in something you cannot see. Something that isn't physical. I'm a Christian and I absolutely love the idea of daemons. I don't think there's anything wrong with them. It's just like an extension of yourself, and of faith.
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Post by Annie on Apr 14, 2005 14:56:16 GMT -5
I'm christian (nondenominational though so I know all about the different things that different parts of the religions do) but I'm interested in Wicca. Wicca sounds more accepting to daemons than christianity. If I do want to be a wiccan I'd still believe in Jesus and God but just not called that. For some reason wei don't like the name 'God.' Wei've allways liked the Native American way of putting it. 'Great Spirit.' I think......Or that other name I don't know the spelling of.
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Post by |3200k1 on Apr 14, 2005 15:01:06 GMT -5
I'm christian (nondenominational though so I know all about the different things that different parts of the religions do) but I'm interested in Wicca. Wicca sounds more accepting to daemons than christianity. If I do want to be a wiccan I'd still believe in Jesus and God but just not called that. For some reason wei don't like the name 'God.' Wei've allways liked the Native American way of putting it. 'Great Spirit.' I think......Or that other name I don't know the spelling of. *nod* The good thing about pagan religions is that you don't have to conform and such. I call the diety either the God and Goddess, or Spirit. I have a friend though who is pagan/christian, and it works for him jsut fine. I think. He's starting to back away from christianity though...*shrug*
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Post by rave & phair on Apr 14, 2005 15:31:11 GMT -5
I was raised non-religiously, tried Christianity when I was nine, and tried Wicca when I was twelve. Now I'm.. I don't know what I am. I'm not religious, but deeply spiritual. I don't believe in an omniscient deity, but I do believe in dæmons and deaths and alternate universes and reincarnation. Though, Baha'i sounds very interesting. I might look into that.
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